[Winona] Should I Do It? Gang Green... and Local Democratic Discourse

[Dwayne and Denine Voegeli]

Ouch.

Guess I asked the wrong question this morning.

;->

Seriously though.

And people wonder why more local elected officials don't take part in Winona 
Online Democracy, and those that do, have almost always left.

Is it "wiser" and safer to avoid these discussion groups and say nothing at 
all?

Look at what happens when you take part in them.

How many times has Bob Sebo said a County Commissioner has not "demonstrated 
a real agenda?"  How many other County Commissioners have ever taken part in 
this listserve?  What is the lesson other elected officials might take away 
from all this?  Should they take part in discussion groups like this or not? 
Would you?

I'm a strong believer in real and robust public discourse as opposed to the 
shallow and insipid sound bite ad campaigns that most of our campaigns have 
devolved into.

I also try to have a thick skin.

It would be easy to shut up and close up but I hope my gravestone will never 
read that I walked away from a good or important discussion.  People may not 
always agree with me but I sure hope they know where I'm coming from.

In the hope that we can rise above the blog standards...

======

About the "Gang Green" blog.

I do not know Mark Knapp very well but here is what I know.  Mark is a very 
intelligent person.  Many years ago we talked a few times.  He left 
Minnesota a few years ago because he thought Greens in Minnesota were not 
good or pure enough for him.  He now lives in Oregon.  I'm not sure if he 
has even ever been to Winona.  Still, he raises some valid points that 
should be responded to.  I'm sorry for what will probably become a long 
e-mail.  I know some (many?) people think I write too much.

1.  When I was elected to serve on the County Board in 2002, I came to 
represent the 49,827 citizens of Winona County, NOT the agenda of the Green 
Party.


2.  Once you are elected and you sit in the hot seat, you have to move 
beyond simple slogans and a simple black and white universe.  You have to be 
extra careful to base your decisions on facts and what is most fair. 
Sometimes that even means disagreeing with some close friends and 
supporters.  It isn't easy to do but it's important to do.


3.  Big farms are not always the problem.  The pictures that Mark Knapp 
showed in his blog web page are not from Winona County and are no where near 
the size of the hog feedlots in our area.  They are misleading pictures. 
There are also misleading descriptions of local farmers on the web page. 
Greg Smith and Chris Sauers are not corporate farmers.  Truth be told, many 
of the problems with our water and soil also come from small and medium 
sized farmers.  Another big problem are those failing septic systems from 
people who like to live in the country but who don't want to smell farms.  I 
was the fourth generation born to my family's dairy farm.  As a young boy I 
watched the family farm go broke and get torn apart.  I saw my father and 
grandfather watch the top soil they worked on for many years get dug up so 
people could build $300,000 houses on nice rural 5-8 acre lots.  Trust me, I 
want to help small and medium sizes farmers survive.  But it's not the few 
big farms with a lot of regulations and restrictions placed upon them who 
are the source of all the problems.  Some people like to create nameless and 
faceless boogey men to scare people (like other politicians do at the 
national and international levels) so they then can reduce complex problems 
into simple bad guys.  Our water and soil problems in Winona County are way 
more complex than any simple slogan could solve.

3.  People like Mark Knapp give all third parties a bad name.  The more I 
serve, the less partisan and more independent I become.  When you serve, you 
have to be much more pragmatic.  You need to work with people where they 
are, not where you want them to be.  I wonder if Mark Knapp has ever served 
in any kind of elected office.


======

About Bob Sebo's comments.

Bob said I have not "demonstrated a real agenda."

Maybe that is accurate.  I will grant him that possibility.

Bob, help me understand though what a "real agenda" looks like.

Could you please name another County Commissioner or other local elected 
official who has "demonstrated a real agenda" in your eyes?

Here is what I have tried to help do.

I have tried,  albeit not always successfully, to work with others to 
implement projects like these:

1.  Local Government Summit

2.  Combined Local Land Planning

3.  Getting Winona on the front edge of Renewable Energy Development

4.  Increasing open and honest discourse about local events

5.  Not following the crowd when it comes to out-of-state conferences, per 
diems, elected official salaries, term limits, etc..

And there are other smaller things.

That is my record.

I will readily admit I'm not perfect but I'm trying my best.

Sorry for the long response.

"I may not agree with what you have to say but I will defend with my life 
your right to say it."

--  Paraphrasing Voltaire

Dwayne Voegeli

Sept. 25, 2006


=====================


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Sebo" <bobsebo at hbci.com>
To: <winona at mnforum.org>
Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 4:26 PM
Subject: [Winona] Should I Do It?


> [Winona Online Democracy]
>
> OK...here goes
>
> Commissioner Voegli has matured over the years in a very positive 
> way...and
> I (Bob swallows had) agree with Linda Fort when she says he is voting the
> law.
>
> But Dwayne hasnt demonstrated a real agenda for me during his time as a
> commissioner...and he has alienated the small number of Greens...he loses 
> to
> Pomeroy I think.
>
> That would make for two new members on the county board in 2007.
>
> Bob Sebo
> Winona

=========================

[Winona Online Democracy]

Jim Galewski wrote:

> Let's see ... What can we talk about?  Surely we can come up
> with a tangible issue.

Here's something to consider.  The only elected Green on the County
Commission supports large-scale livestock confinement operations --
casting the deciding vote on two permits less than a year apart.

Ecological wisdom?  BETRAYAL is the more accurate description.
Representing the antithesis of the green worldview, the local
Chamber of Commerce recently chirped, "Good call Commissioner!"

http://www.knappster.org/gangrene.html

Mark Knapp

>
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